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How To Carry Conversation (Social Vibing)


posted by Donovan at 7:04 PM

Ever wondered what do to inbetween the lines, gambits, and cocky and funny? Here ya go.

This is reprint of the mASF post. Awesome stuff from Tyler Durden.

To me, this is a very important post.

Social Intelligence. Having struggled so hard to learn it, I have so much to say on this topic. In this post I'd like to specifically discuss social vibing and insecurity (a very focused, but important peice of the puzzle).

There are many subcommunications that are being telegraphed at all times in any interaction. Both verbal and non-verbal.

Social interactions have features and customs that I suppose are designed to make them pleasant.

As social animals, we have the attribute of actually enjoying socializing just for the sake of socializing.

We socially VIBE.

People who break the vibe are considered socially unintelligent, and despite being perhaps very good/worthwhile people, they will come across poorly.

Most people, once you get to know them, are really worthwhile. I've rarely met someone, who when put in a position where I was by circumstance made to get to know them, that I didn't come to like.

So what's the difference between someone who is COOL and someone who is UNCOOL?

The way that they COME ACROSS. Their level of social intelligence. Their ability to CONVEY it. TELEGRAPH it. SUBCOMMUNICATE it.

Understanding how to socially vibe telegraphs that you are secure with yourself. Failing to understand telegraphs insecurity.

Much of this post assumes that early game is now past, and you are in comfort building (if you use my PU model, if you are using Juggler's, for example, then this would apply from the very start because he is full rapport).



Laughter is not only a stress relief mechanism. It's actualy a social mechanism.

Laughter basically shows that your social group is vibing well. Monkeys, while they can't talk like we can, still laugh when they are in rapport with each other.

Think to when you were telling a joke, and the group vibe was just so TIGHT. The people were starting to laugh before you'd even delivered the punch line. Maybe you said "I haven't even told the joke yet, and you guys are laughing". And they can't figure out why, and they laugh even more as you say this.

Also, think of how when you use cocky tactics, girls laugh/giggle. This is a sign that they are wanting to vibe with you.

The movie "Goodfellas", in the scene where Joe Pesci is telling jokes at the restaurant table, and everyone is laughing harder and harder. Ray Liotta can't stop laughing. It's not just the humour. It's the VIBE.

People who are not socially intelligent will LAUGH AT THEIR OWN JOKES. They laugh prior to the group starting to laugh.

Notice next time that someone laughs at their own joke first. Were you JUST ABOUT to laugh, but then didn't when they did first?

They were attempting to FILL IN THE RAPPORT GAP.

When the boss of an office tells a joke, everyone laughs. When the beta male tells it, he worries that nobody will, and laughs at his own joke to fill in the so-called rapport gap.

Concentrate on VIBING, and don't try to artificially push rapport.

Better, is to WAIT until the group laughs, and THEN laugh with them.

This gap is also seen when people say "right" after all of their sentences. They are trying to FILL IN the "right" that the other person SHOULD have said themself, IF THEY HAD been socially vibing properly.



People, when talking, use weird (when you think about it) rhetorical sequencing. Here is an example:

A guy is excited that he got a cheap deal on a coat.


GUY: You'll never guess how much I got this coat for.
FRIEND: Wow.. Umm, 200$.
GUY: No man. 45$
FRIEND: Wow.. Nice man.


GUY: You'll never guess how much I got this coat for.
FRIEND: Oh you got a deal. I guess 30$ then.
GUY: Umm, actually 45$
FRIEND: Oh.. well that's not bad.


His thought process was: "I'll show GUY that I'm smart. I'm clever enough to pickup on the fact that if he said "You'll never guess what I paid", that he got a deal. Then I'll have shown him that I passed his test."

His INSECURITY caused him to miss out on the social vibing, which was intended to build excitement and wasn't a test at all.

The secure guy, although realizing that the coat was really cheap, would still guess something lower end, but still high enough that if the guy's deal wasn't as great as he thought, he'll still feel good. After all, its bought, so why worry about that stuff (UNLESS you seriously could hookup a massively cheaper deal and return the coat (which the socially intelligent guy would ascertain before even suggesting it), in which case the happiness derived from that would outweigh actually telling the guy that he didn't get the best deal).



HB: I just got this crazy shirt. Look at it.
PUA: Wow.. Cute!


HB: I jsut got tihs crazy shirt. Look at it.
PUA: Cool.. Hey you know in L.A. that shirt would be nothing. I should bring you there sometime.



(Friend1 drives to Toronto for the first time with Friend2)

FRIEND1: Wow man, look at that building.. That rocks..
FRIEND2: Whoa.. That's pretty big dude.


FRIEND1: Wow man, look at that building.. That rocks..
FRIEND2: Dude, that's cool.. But man, you should see NYC. Man, NYC KILLS this place.

(JLAIX: If you're reading this, who does this remind you of? HINT: His first name is *LERON*).

Again, with these examples, the person who is not vibing right does not get something: The purpose of the initial comment was NOT to ACTUALLY debate it. It was to SOCIALLY VIBE. The content was not the REAL communication. It was a surface for SUBCOMMUNICATION, which INTENDED to say "Let's have a nice time, and have rapport with eachother and relax."

The insecure and socially unintelligent person is taking the sentences of the first person, and FIELDING them as OPPORTUNITIES TO QUALIFY HIMSELF.



We all get our moment in the sun at some point.

You'll notice, that when you are holding court, that sometimes people will be insecure with that.

The secure guy will recognize when its someone's turn to hold court, and not fight it.

A person who is secure will talk to ADD EMPHASIS to a point. He will not DISPUTE a point while someone is holding court. He knows that he'll have his chance LATER, and that right now someone is trying to get a point across.

Guys who are insecure will constantly dispute points whenever they see the opening. They view is at an opportunity to demonstrate their value.

They CANNOT RESIST the temptation.

For an example that everyone reading this can recoginze, look to this chatboard. Something tight will get posted. Insecure posters will nightpick semantics. Like "While this is important, its maybe an 8 out of 10 level importance. Not a 10 like you said." The secure poster, if he finds the level of emphasis on a level where its honestly misinformative, might post "I think that x,y,z are really good, man. I think that you might consider less emphasis on it though, because a,b,c are important as well. Good post though man, I like x,y,z"

ANOTHER feature you'll see on this board, and that is in the same vein, are THROWING LITTLE NEGS or TRYING TO COME OFF AUTHORITATIVE WHEN ITS NOT YOUR PLACE.

For example, you'll see guys trying to get rapport with someone they don't know by throwing little negs.

*OLD* FRIEND 1: Hey Stevo, you fucking bastard.. C'mere gimme a hug

*NEW* ACQUAINTANCE: C'mere you fucker, help me out.

The second is BAD vibing, because he is trying to FORCE rapport with subcommunication that is only appropriate of old friends.

Similarly, you'll see guys who try to come off authoritative. You'll see it on the board, where a guy will post something quality, and someone who doesn't like him will post "That's very quality material. Good that you posted something of quality". It's like he's trying to come off authoritative. Like he realizes that he's negged on the guy on the chatboard, and he feels insecure that the guy he negged produced something worthwhile. So he has to come in and be all authoritative, like "I can show everyone that I recognize a good post". Guys in real life will see someone who they publically disliked starting to improve himself, and say things like "Good that you're improving. KEEP IT UP." By this, they are trying to CONTROL what is happening. They are trying to say "Improve, because *I*, the AUTHORITY, approved."

More on this... If you've ever ever ran a very good presentation at work or school, and you see an insecure person come up to you and criticize.

They don't realize its YOUR TURN TO HOLD COURT. Their turn is LATER.

So they throw little negs at you. Like they always have to offer advice on how you could have improved it. They can't just say "Good job man".

Or they have to nit-pick subtleties. Like they can't say "That was awesome". They have to first go over their advise on where you fucked up.

For a real life example that most guys on this board can recognize, when you meet up with another guy from the scene through PAIR, if he's insecure he'll do the following:

1- Talk about game non-stop, rather than PLAY.
2- Watch you do a set, and CRITICIZE on what could be improved, rather than encourage.
3- You tell him about something that happened, and he gives you ADVICE, rather than just listening.



When socializing, a good vibe will be set when the reason for being there is to enjoy eachother's company.

However, sometimes a bad vibe can be set when the presupposition is that you're there for a SPECIFIC PURPOSE.

Of course, there is nothing wrong with purpose. It has a place, and more of my daily interactions have a purpose than those that are to socially vibe.

However, recognizing that tagging a set purpose to an interaction will often stop a nice vibe from occuring, will help with a pickup.

Insecure people will often LATCH onto a purpose for the conversation, as a way of maintaining it.

Then they'll leave on a "high note" once that purpose is exhausted.

This is a MAJOR cause of flaking. You maintained a conversation with a girl, but the presupposition was that you were discussing an issue. You left on the high note, but didn't realize that you were actually REINFORCING to the girl that you are not socially compatible.

When going to meet up with you again, she'll think "Well, we really have nothing more to talk about though. I don't want to have nothing to talk about, because that would feel unfortable"

As guys, we don't care. We might feel nervous that we'll have nothing to talk about, but we want sex. But girls, if the feel uncomfortable, they won't show up. That's one reason why guys who smoke pot get laid alot. Girls rarely flake on them, because they have that social presupposition that will give comfort. For the rest of us who don't smoke, we use SOCIAL VIBING rather than FORCED social interaction, to maintain comfort.

Clinging too strenously to a particular topic can come across insecure. When you say to a friend "Let's go have a beer", the subtext is "Let's go socially vibe". You don't go discuss an issue, and say "Let's reconvene later". You go and you chill. You have a FRIENDSHIP. Non-party-chicks rarely flake on guys they have both attraction AND friendship with. But they do flake on guys who attract them, tongue them down, and say "Give me your #."



In summary, how does this apply in practical terms?

Most of it comes in, during comfort building phase. Or if you use a different PU model than I do, then its when you're getting to know the girl either way.

1) Don't crack jokes to the girl, and laugh at them before she does. Wait. You'll notice that it sometimes takes even 10-15 seconds for a joke to process. But it DOES. I usually bust on her for it "Oh, slow processing time.. That's OK, you're my little sister.. I didn't adopt you for your brains"

Also, don't say "right" after everything. It can come across beta. Right?

2) When a girl is trying to impress you, RECOGNIZE it as her QUALIFYING herself. If you reject it, you'll come across insecure, or socially unaware.

This is DIFFERENT than the C&F stuff early, where you break rapport on purpose. In fact, much like how the "25 Points to not trying too hard" assumed that you were in EARLY GAME, this post to some extent at least assumes you are PAST early game.

SHARE her excitement by recognizing rhetorical social sequencing.

3) Recognize when its your turn to talk, and when somebody else is being focused on.

MUCH MUCH of the mid/later game is the chick qualifying herself to you.

Because our pickup model encorporates alot of not trying, you'll notice your best pickups (with NON-party-chicks at least) are with the ones who at some point EARN your attention.

They perceive that they've WON your interest, and plan to COLLECT THE PRIZE (your dick in their mouth).

4) If a girl tells you about a problem, just LISTEN and change her emotion. Say "Ouch, that's sounds tough.. But hey, you're a powerpuff girl, and you know you're to fiesty to let this stop you.. Let's check out x,y,z"

Definetely don't offer advice. If she wants advice, she'll say "WHAT SHOULD I DO?" Unless someone asks me what to do, I rarely offer advice. OR, I say "You know i have experience with this, so maybe later you can ask me about it."

5) Focus on SOCIALLY VIBING and don't CLING TO TOPICS. This will prevent flaking, and make her feel comfortable around you.

Don't leave on a high note. THERE IS NO HIGHNOTE. There is only vibing and flipping the switches that she needs to have switched in order to fuck you.

OK retards, that's it. Cool post, RIGHT? HAHAHAHHAHAA..



Key to all geekiness ... :)

haa, I like that analysis - I agree completely.

It's true, geeks need a presupposition to hang out. Interesting. I think I'm a natural geek, for sure.

Thanks for all the great feedback. I thought the guys' answers to the questions that were given were really bang on, and covered my bases.

I suppose this sort of approach is the "external" way of coming at the problem.

The other way of course would be the "internal" way, which would mean improving your inner game so that you're not needy and you're not insecure.

I think that inner approach is great and has alot of value.

At the same time, the externally focused approach is what solved my internal issues, because once I figured out the points of how internally-balanced people acted, I got laid and then started to feel better internally.

Like one thing I like to do with newbs is tell the girls from the set I'm in that they have to tongue him down and grab his dick, or I'll leave and blow them off. Or I'll tell a girl from a 2set that if her friend isn't warm to my friend, I'll leave because he's bored. The girls do this, and then the newb walks around strutting like he's the man for the rest of the night. Then he PU's another separate chick on his own, gets MOMENTUM, and it snowballs. These are extreme cases of the externally focused approach, but just focusing on the mannerisms of successful guys can do the same.

At the same time, for alot of guys they really need internal work. Like no success will fix them internally. So I think that both approaches are great.

I know Twentysix is now running great game, and he did both externally focused stuff (going out 4 nights a week), as well as seeing a psychologist.

Tyler Durden


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posted by Donovan at 7:04 PM Dating Advice for Men


Anonymous Anonymous said...

Amazing post from TD, thanks for digging that 1 up

1:39 AM, March 19, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So that was what I was doing! Nobody explains it like TD. Thanks.

11:51 AM, March 22, 2006  

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Meet Wayne Elise


posted by Donovan at 10:51 PM

In the fast-emerging community of seduction, Wayne Elise (Juggler) is a relative old-timer. He was the second person to begin teaching infield workshops way back in 2001, and many of his ideas are the underpinnings of the modern seduction movement. (He has since gone on to 'post-modern' seduction.) He has trained many of the top people in the field who have become popular trainers themselves.

Wayne Elise
Wayne Elise aka Juggler

Wayne has worked a few other jobs besides teaching. If you know where to look you can still spot him occasionally performing on the streets as a busker and in the clubs as a comedian. A bit of a recluse, his advice and trained eye have also made him sought out by comedians, magicians and variety performers as a special director where he helps to reshape their acts to connect with audiences better, stronger and faster. Although he likes to be thought of as a regular guy, many who have met him consider him one of the world's most interesting conversationalists, and of course he is a master flirt.

Going by the moniker 'Juggler' he became involved in the seduction community in 2000 by typing up advice in his spare time onto seduction websites. These postings were often short (a result of his then nonexistent typing skills) and completely eye-opening.

A three page question might get a one line answer, 'Don't ask her so many questions,' 'Seduce them both,' 'Wear something red,' 'Combine compliments with commands.' A page-long Juggler post became a collector's item. It didn't take long until people wanted to learn 'Juggler Method' in person.

After taking a year and a half off Wayne returned to the seduction community in 2004 and is enjoying, once again, helping men improve their skills with women. He lives in Ann Arbor Michigan, likes 'cheesy' Barry Manilow music and travels way too much.

Wayne was mentioned in Neil Strauss's book "The Game", and currently runs Charisma Arts, teaching men how to become more successful in social interactions.

From a newspaper article about Wayne's appearance at the Cliff List Seminar in 2005:

"There's a big schism within the seduction community," says Wayne "Juggler" Elise, who started Charisma Sciences in Ann Arbour, Michigan, four yeas ago, and now has four employees. "You've got some NLP guys, others like [Toronto-native seduction guru] Mystery, who use 'can openers'- which are little stories they tell. I try the natural approach," meaning less of a reliance on special tricks and head games.

Elise says the typical guy becomes an adherent "after a breakup or after taking a girl out on three dates, spending lots of money on her and then being told she just wants to be friends."

It takes about three months to overcome bad habits, according to Elise. "The most common mistake is trying to be too safe, too conservative, caring too much about our success," he says. "Guys get too careful as each girl means too much to him." Elise also advises against button-downs and loafers. "I tell guys to dress a little crazier. Women see that and it lets them be crazy too, and express that part of themselves."

As in life, the searing pain of ego injury is a challenge. "Never take rejection personally," says Wayne Elise. "She's not reacting to your real person. She's reacting to her experience of being approached by every guy in the last 10 years."

And if all else fails: "Pretend you're Colin Farrell. He's so himself, he doesn't care about how people perceive him."

Get Wayne Elise's eBook at Charisma Arts
For other related posts about Wayne Elise (Juggler) visit:
Wayne Elise wrote a chapter in Neil Strauss's book, "The Game: Penetrating the Secret Society of Pickup Artists". This blog is your number one resource of information about Neil Strauss and Wayne Elise.


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posted by Donovan at 10:51 PM Dating Advice for Men

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Successful Online Dating With Some Of The Pitfalls!


posted by Donovan at 10:28 AM

Oh online dating...

I think I started to explore the dynamic world of online dating back in 2000 or so.

It was a fairly lame encounter, and I got some pretty crappy responses... then again there was a lot to my profile that reeked of AFCness. My photo's weren't like they are now, and my 'knowledge' wasn't at the level it is now.

Skip six years ahead now...

I attend college, and one of the most valuable resources I have for meeting girls is through this medium which is the Internet. It's literal dynamite!

If any of you are college students (probably about 10% of you), then you know the site I'm talking about. (No, not myspace) Although I have met some hot girls via that recently.

On a side note, this HB8.5, 5'10 blonde will be coming up from California soon to see me. That should be a great experience, and I'm actually alittle nervous.

I noticed that most of my dates now come via an online interaction, not because I can't approach women in the field, but simply because of it's sheer convenience. It's like comparing a buffet to random finger picking food. Online you can have some much leverage with so little investment. (Once you know how...)

A month ago, you might have remembered the South African model I dated for a few weeks. We'll... I met her ONLINE. We had ONE friend in common, so I started with a brief opener of "Do you know blah blah at blah high school." Then it started... (Read about "Along came a model..." Link )

One word of warning however...

Some girls are particuarly anal about personal details.

For some reason they can give out their lifelong goals, personal experiences, among other things, but if you ask where they live (eg. general area) they sometimes on occasion get freaked out. Such an occasion last night. (This has only happened ONCE)

I had conversed with this HB7? woman for a week or so, brief messages, and we had TWO friends in common. I asked in passing, "Where about's do you live?" She said, "Don't take offense, but I don't give out personal information." I just said, "Eh, Don't worry." I'll probably never speak to her again.

Having dated numerous women via online using these similar techniques, I found it not offensive, but just lame that she would be that defensive. Defintely a damper on her personality, and conversational skills. (If she would have said, "You'll find out soon enough... where do you live?" That would have been cool) Especially considering we are friends with more than one friend. What made it more of a hit to my ego, is that she wasn't even that hot...

Having said all that, that was just ONCE.

Now for a short plug!

David Deangelo's Meeting Women Online program is the BEST program for this subject. He features special guest speakers like Neil Strauss (Style), among others that are well-known among the community. (who actually expounds on the whole process of the the infamous "Cube" technique) Awesome.

It's on DVD, or AUDIO CD, and has video clips on the website to preview. You can view them here.

My online dating has skyrocketed since viewing the program. It's not just ONLINE, but also gives you a great foundation for alot of other conversation banter, and making yourself more interesting overall.

Check out the pics below.

David Deangelo Seminar Photo

Neil Strauss Style Photo David Deangelo Seminar

Speakers include David Deangelo, the other David's, Neil Strauss (Style), Craig, and a tonne of others.

David Deangelo Pick up Online Seminar

As for me... I'm in love with online dating, it is simply another avenue to meet more women while you are out there in the field picking up.

Why not have lots of options?


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posted by Donovan at 10:28 AM Dating Advice for Men


Anonymous Anonymous said...

Donovon, I'd appreciate some advice.

So I was just screwing around with the online dating thing and I put up an abercrombie model as my profile lets just say it was more of a joke then anything else. so some of the replies back I got were:

'whats up with your pic...' which I replied back C&F style, 'what, you don't like it? :)'

however, there were some other ones that were pretty damn serious in their e-mails. so what to do now? how do you turn it around that it was a joke? funny how a picture totally changes the game.


7:59 PM, March 16, 2006  
Blogger Donovan said...


The girl that freaked out about personal details, contacted me again... wants to get together. haha sssshhhwing!

8:33 AM, March 17, 2006  
Blogger Donovan said...

I would simply... not sure about that one.

"What, you don't like it?" isn't C&F btw.

Something like, "oh those were my model days, hot huh?! Would you rather see a recent one, I'm warning you tho, I look hotter." Thats C&F.

8:35 AM, March 17, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

ah okay. i gotta go check out the whole cocky funny series with deangelo.

thanks for the tips nevertheless.


12:15 PM, March 17, 2006  
Blogger ricky said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

7:35 PM, July 19, 2006  
Blogger ricky said...

Donovan a little deepened question about the first comment on C&F, I think I've a problem with that, I think I just don't get the dynamic, so maybe you can help me out a bit.

For instance: If you're walking on the street and a girl makes Eye contact, and you give her a facial expression "What are you looking at me" (the 1 eyebrow thing-stuff-something like that...) is that a bit rude or is that C&F?

And if you do the same thing and then point with your head to another guy with the meaning "You should pick him up, he's hot!" (which isn't the case of course). Is that C&F? (I think this is C&F by the way, but i've become a little uncertain about it).

And lines like this: "awhhh... it's so OBVIOUS, *sigh* girls are always the same. *looking with the "i-know you-from-the-inside-out-look*" what kind of thing is that, because that isn't C&F right?

And then the last type of line, I think this is more of an insult, but once again I don't really know it for certain, because of that line i can't see.
"Your nose is shiny"
"Yeah you can join the circus with that"
enthusiastically "Come on lets find a circus for your special talent!"

Let me know a bit of what you think it would be a great help.

Ricky (The Netherlands)

7:36 PM, July 19, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

So i date a lot of women online but what i want to know is how do i get them to meet me right off the bat, i mean i get tired of trying to convince them im a nice and waiting about a week to meet them. Help?

9:45 PM, July 20, 2006  
Blogger Donovan said...

That's what the meeting women online program is, how to get them off the net and on a date, bed, etc

11:24 AM, July 21, 2006  
Blogger Mike said...

So you think David D's online dating material is better than David M's stuff at

11:42 AM, July 26, 2007  

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Meet David Deangelo


posted by Donovan at 3:28 PM

David Deangelo
David Deangelo

David DeAngelo is a leading dating advice expert based in the United States. He has applied various schools of thought, psychological theories and his own experiences and opinons in his "Double Your Dating" products. Originally a student of Ross Jeffries and using the nickname Sisonyph, DeAngelo's ideas were first widely published and publicized in the underground seduction newsletter called Cliff's List.

DeAngelo's commercial career began with the release of his first book "Double Your Dating" in 2001. Since then, he has released many products aimed at helping men become successful with women and dating.

According to DeAngelo, women do not feel attraction to men consciously, instead dating and forming romantic relationships with men to whom they are attracted unconsciously. Furthermore, while some believe that good looks are what attracts women to men, DeAngelo disagrees, arguing that physical features have very little to do with attraction. One of DeAngelo's favorite lines is: "Attraction isn't a choice".

Because most men are unfamiliar with what causes attraction according to DeAngelo, women dictate when and where relationships are formed. Furthermore, since attraction is unconscious, DeAngelo claims, attempting to appeal to women using reason will therefore be unsuccessful. DeAngelo implores men to become successful by taking charge and shifting the balance of power from women to themselves.

DeAngelo often uses simplified terms in his material to describe both "incorrect" and "desired" male behavior.

Some of these include:

The Inner Wuss: a character trait of men developed through time that causes them to become submissive around women in order for them to get the women's approval. DeAngelo claims that women prefer men who will stand up to them (see also: Nice guy syndrome).

Status: a perception of how important a person is to society. DeAngelo believes that most of status is determined by a man's actions, and that men should learn to communicate higher status as a means of attracting women. He claims that communicating higher status to a woman creates attraction.

Confidence: a loosely-defined term used to describe the outward reflection of men who have high status (see above). While some define the term as being happy with one's life and circumstances, DeAngelo uses it more often to describe those who may not be completely happy with their lives but are not rattled by unfortunate events and women's "tests".

Cocky and funny: describes a technique that involves making socially inappropriate, arrogant and humorous comments at certain times in a conversation.

Counterintuitive behavior: DeAngelo's description of some of his techniques to attract women, as they are the opposite of what most people think is attractive. Examples of such behavior include teasing a woman offhandedly and refusing to compliment her appearance.

Life changes: DeAngelo reiterates that the purpose of his programs is to effect a complete personality and lifestyle change among men that will help them achieve romantic success. He, and many of his followers, state that they disapprove of men who utilize his teachings for physical pleasure only.

Emulate the Successful: DeAngelo encourages the following and emulation of those successful with women. Interviews with those very successful (who have usually changed their dating lifes completely) are available for purchase.

Related David Deangelo links:
Double Your Dating eBook
Meeting Women Online Program
Cocky and Funny Program
What People Think of David Deangelo

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posted by Donovan at 3:28 PM Dating Advice for Men

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How To Increase A Woman's Desire For You


posted by Donovan at 6:02 PM



You are a saint. A giant among insects... Ok, maybe not, but it gets through the obligatory ass-kissing since you have helped me so much. Let me begin...

I've had my eyes on this particular girl for quite some time, and I could tell she was already into me quite a bit, but we had never made anything of it. Last week, she decided to "be bold" and ask ME out, instead of the other way around (you can see I'm already doing something right). She asked if I wanted to go see a movie some time; instead of freaking out and jumping at the chance, I said I'm rather tired of this whole 'movie date' thing. If she wanted to get me, she was going to have to be a little more creative. She was rather shocked and felt somewhat rejected. Later in the conversation, we were got to talking about this stalker (wussy who needs a life) that seems to be in love with her, and she hates him. He had asked her if she wanted to accompany him to a football game the next night that they both were already going to.

She said she really wished that I would come with her so this guy would leave her alone. I thought, "Ok. This will be my good deed for the year." and said I would go. She ends up driving me to the game. Upon arrival, she just HAD to braid her hair, and asked me to wait around while she did so. I stood there for a second, and then walked off. She started yelling at me to wait; I simply replied, "I'll see you inside the gate." waved and walked off. Once inside, I didn't see her come in, but soon felt someone grab my butt (it was her). We went on into the stadium, she soon saw someone she knew and went to talk to them, dragging me along. I stood around for a second, then wandered off, since I had seen someone I knew as well. She comes to find me soon, and we go off to our seats. Her stalker had seen us as we were going to our seats and decided to stay with us for part of the night.

She began talking to him, and I did my own thing. I wandered off numerous times throughout the night and generally acted very secure and like I didn’t need a thing in the world (especially her!). Following the game, as we walked back to her car I could tell that she wanted me badly due to some things she had been saying. She drove me back to where my car was waiting and we talked for twenty minutes or so in her car. There was some hand holding and such going on during the conversation. She said, "You know we're just going to end up making out - you're just delaying the inevitable." Bingo. I shrugged it off, and we continued talking. About ten minutes later, she said, "It's getting late; I really should be getting home." Obviously a ploy to get things started, as it was only 10:15 PM. I shrugged it off, again. A few minutes pass, and she says, "It's late, I really need to go." I say, "Alright." I open the door and get out of the car. She says, "Where are you going?" I reply nonchalantly, "I just don't think you want it badly enough yet." Score #2. I walk off to my car; she immediately jumps out of the car and begins walking to my car as well. I get to the car and put the key in the door and she sticks her leg in front of the door with this defiant attitude. I say, "You know, I've never been raped in an empty parking lot before..."

You can imagine what went on from there... J

Thanks Dave.

Now, on to the questions: First, now that I've used my best line ever ("I just don't think you want it badly enough yet."), do you have any suggestions on what to do and say next time to create that same anticipation/desire in her?

Also, you always say that I need to be the first to end the conversation, but many of the girls that I am interested in are somewhat sporadic and tend to call, IM, etc. when they don't have a lot of time. Quite often, they are the ones to end the conversation before I have a chance to. How do I take this? Should I just reply, "Alright. I'll catch you later." Acting like I could care less?

D. Knoxville, TN


Great story.

I'm sure that anyone reading this would say "Yea, but she already liked you"... I wish you would have told the story from the beginning, because I'll bet you MADE her like you with more of the same type communication that you described here.

The one thing that you clearly understand here is how SEXUAL TENSION works.

You understand how to take a small spark of desire from her and AMPLIFY it until it's literally EXPLOSIVE.

If you keep amplifying and letting the tension build with a particular woman, this is the kind of result you'll get... and she will LOVE you for it.


Things like making her come up with a more "interesting" date idea, walking away from her when other guys would have clung to her, shrugging off her comments about the two of you getting together, etc. are the magic ingredients.

Most guys DESTROY all the sexual tension at every possible opportunity... they take every chance they can to SCREW THINGS UP, because they don't know better...

The fact is that most men just don't UNDERSTAND how women get turned on.

And most men don't understand that if you really want a woman to WANT you, then you NEED to get her turned on. It's not going to happen by itself.

Here's another interesting aspect of that thing called ATTRACTION:

The bigger the challenge you are, and the more intense the sexual tension, the more aroused a woman will become... so that when you finally do connect physically it's pure electricity.

Again, most men can't HANDLE sexual tension. They feel uncomfortable when the situation isn't "clear cut", and they screw things up.

One of the things you mentioned doing was "shrugging off" her obvious "come ons" to you.

This kind of thing makes no sense to most guys.

But it makes sense to me.

And it made a LOT of sense to HER.

When a woman throws out a sexual comment, etc. most guys screw it up. That's because they don't know the SECRET about these types of comments.

When you're a major challenge, it naturally means that she's not IN CONTROL of the situation.

Attractive women are USED to being in control, so when they're NOT in control, they get agitated. It really bothers them.

So they TEST. They use all kinds of interesting tricks and tactics to see if you're just FAKING like you're actually in control of yourself and the situation.

One of the most obvious tests is throwing out a sexual comment.

She might mention that she loves sex, or that she thinks you guys have a chance of "hooking up", or some other "tease".

But make no mistake about it, these comments are not at all the innocent remarks that they appear to be.

She's watching VERY closely to see if you'll take the bait.

It's a woman's last resort when she feels like she isn't controlling the situation to see if you'll crumble to SOMETHING. -- If you say something like "Really? You think we're going to hook up? That would be cool" she KNOWS SHE'S IN CONTROL.

If you say "Yea, you think so? I don't know, I'm not that easy..." then it just dials up the tension, mystery, and challenge.

OK, so you've asked me a couple of questions as well...

What should you do NEXT time you see her to keep the tension building...?

Well, if something works, KEEP DOING IT.

If she enjoyed it the first time, do it again.

This time wait a little longer. Make her think about it a little bit more.

Women LOVE anticipation. They love to feel the rush that something is going to happen... but not know WHEN.

If you REALLY want to take things to the next level, take a page from popular movies and romance novels.

Don't just kiss her. Kiss her PASSIONATELY.

Pull her body into yours as you kiss her.

Then push her away and say "You're bad!".

Stop for awhile. Make her think about it. Then start again when she isn't expecting it.

These are the types of things that make women think about you all the time when you're gone... and call you in the middle of the night because they want to see you. Really.

Most men are so damn BORING when it comes to this stuff! They do NOTHING to make a woman FEEL the powerful feelings that she's always wanted to feel.

You be the one to do it, and you'll be the one she always wants around.

Your second question was about ending calls and conversations first.

The REASON why you should end all conversations and other interactions with women first is that it conveys a clear message:


It turns YOU into the one that's desirable.

Most guys cling, and try to keep a woman on the phone for a long time. They desire a woman's attention and approval, and they make it clear that this is what they're after.

Of course, this only demonstrates pure WEAKNESS to an attractive woman.

And weakness (or Wussness) isn't ATTRACTIVE.

If you run into a woman who's always on the run, don't let it get to you. To put it
differently, don't become obsessed with her just because she's never available!

The answer is to just take things to the next level.

Here's a GREAT little technique...

An amazing and simple way to handle this kind of thing is to just say "OK, bye" without any other comments.

She says "I have to go, my friends are waiting for me outside". Just say "OK, bye" and SHUT UP.

80% of the time, she'll say "No, wait! I'm just really busy, call me in a few days" etc.

You can't "kind of" do this.

You have to be READY.

She's TESTING you by playing hard to get. It's a game. Have fun with it.

As soon as she says "I have to go, my laundry is in the dryer", you SHOOT back "OK, bye" in a VERY abrupt tone and SHUT UP.

It will create a funny, uncomfortable silence for just a second.

Most of the time, she'll say something in a tone of voice that says "That was weird", and then she'll give some kind of explanation or ask you why you were so short with her.

Of course, this is a great opportunity to bust her balls and create some fun banter.

Again, you'll often have her say something like "I'm really busy right now. I'm sorry. Call me tomorrow and let's do something". At this point, you can say "Yea, if you're lucky. Bye!".

Not cold. Not mean. Just short and to the point.

Then, when you call her next, it was HER that asked for the call.

You get to call up and say "Well, last time we talked you were begging me to call you... and I felt so bad for you that I finally broke down".

What we're talking about here is DESIRE... and more importantly, INCREASING IT.

In most interactions with women there is an opportunity to SPARK the chemistry... the sexual tension... the desire... and then there are many opportunities to AMPLIFY that desire.

But here's the BAD news:

If you do not understand all of the little steps from the first meeting to the bedroom, and know exactly how to smoothly progress from one step to the next, then you're going to keep failing with women.

It's that simple.

If you DO understand all of the steps, and you know EXACTLY what to do in order to smoothly transition from one to the next, then you are MUCH more likely to succeed.

One of the most IMPORTANT steps is controlling your own emotions. If you're nervous and freaked out, then you'll make her nervous.

We humans can SMELL fear and nervousness... and women are the best at it.

I'm telling you, I used to have no clue about attracting women... but now that I do, I can date any type of women I want. And it's a damn good feeling.

And if you'd like an introduction to my main concepts, then you need to go download and read my online eBook "Double Your Dating". You can download it right now and be reading it within a few minutes. It's here:

Double Your Dating 2nd Edition

I'll talk to you again soon.

Your Friend,

David D.
Watch Live Pickup Videos

posted by Donovan at 6:02 PM Dating Advice for Men


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