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Do you have a high turn over rate with women?


posted by Donovan at 11:42 PM

I was thinking the other day, about variation yet again. It seems to me that every time I get alot of options, they seem to disappear just as quickly as they came.

David Deangelo, learn the secrets of seductionYou need to be out constantly getting fresh numbers from women to take out. People ask on occasion, are you dating anyone? I usually answer with "No, not really". Even though I am casual with a few. When people hear that, they might think, "What a loser, he doesn't have a girlfriend." When in actual fact, my turnover rate is much higher than theirs. It seems to be about 5 or more additional quality beautiful women a week. The problem you can sometimes have with being successful with women, is that you get picker. Its my downfall now.

Eg. I get a number, call them, they call back, we go out, and it doesn't click. NEXT... (For an example of a truly golden way to ask a woman out, check out this previous post.)

If you're coming from a place of scarcity then you might try alot harder to get along, or forgive some of her imperfections. I wish I could go back to that time in my life (not)... (of course, imperfections being personality based not physical.... ;) )

This is the flow of my dating life. I have a few permanent women that I like to have around, but most of the time, I believe you will know when you meet a woman that connects well with you. Why bother hanging on to a beautiful girl just for beauty's sake?

I was never that successful with girls growing up. I became a success through studying David DeAngelo's material in Double Your Dating. His e-Book is amazing, and I HIGHLY recommend it to anyone who wants to get this part of their life handled. It's all about confidence, and game. He goes into detail about both subjects, and gives you some great examples of how to do it.

I heard he has recently reduced the price of the 2nd version of the book, and it's now ONLY $19.97, I paid tonnes more a year ago for less material. Grab yourself a copy and email me with your experiences and comments.
I'd love to hear from you!
Click here for the 30 day free trial e-Book, or sign up here for his free dating tips newsletter which should have its own subscription fee itself (so jam packed with great info each week).
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posted by Donovan at 11:42 PM Dating Advice for Men


Anonymous Mike D said...

good site

6:21 PM, October 17, 2005  
Blogger yana said...

"Your online guide to being the attractive male that meets, attracts, dates, and seduces the most beautiful women"

hehehe. cool. ; p

3:34 AM, February 07, 2006  

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Hollywood Podcast with Neil Strauss 8/12/05

posted by Donovan at 1:39 PM

I found Tim Coyne's (Hollywood Podcast) interview with Neil Strauss author of "The Game: Penerating the Secret Society of Pickup Artists". A good insight into the book, and the community. He talks about his beginnings before the community, into the community and some of the techniques he got from various seduction sources.

Click on the POD image below to download.
Click to download


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posted by Donovan at 1:39 PM Dating Advice for Men


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"Sleep With Me" Article (2005) about Neil Strauss and "The Game"


posted by Donovan at 12:43 PM

Guys I put this in, as a note to those who just can't grasp such a concept as one we believe.

Former New York Times-man seeks to become a confident playa. So why does his book seem so desperate?
by Mike Seely from the Seattle Weekly

neil Strauss, pua, sex, pickup, seduction, sexualityHad Neil Strauss ended The Game: Penetrating the Secret Society of Pick-Up Artists (ReganBooks, $28.95) after 146 pages, he'd have a wickedly economical book that's impossible to put down. Had it ended after 205 pages, it'd still qualify as a truly engrossing chronicle of a fascinating, misogynistic subculture of freaks and geeks who trade in their anime porn and eight-sided die for platform boots, feather boas, and dumb, hot chicks whom they manipulate through a labyrinth of head games that's extensively calibrated and hilariously termed (the glossary may be the 10 most entertaining pages).

But because Strauss drags The Game out to 437 pages, the book morphs into a grating, narcissistic Fight Club knockoff in which Strauss clumsily elevates his role from supporting playa to a sexual superstar who arrogantly proclaims, "I was no longer in the game to meet women; I was in the game to lead men." Gone is the likably self-deprecating journalist/nerd who can count the amount of lays he's had in his life on six fingers. Once he's elevated into the PUA (pickup artist) fellowship's hierarchy, he - and the book - become insufferable. Novice PUAs start shaving their heads and wearing goatees, eyeliner, and frilly shirts to mimic Strauss' signature "peacock" look. This all goes straight to Strauss' noggin, and The Game goes south.

That's a shame, because at the journalistically adroit outset of The Game, Strauss discovers a ruthless collection of sexual self-help gurus and pupils whose tactics border on date rape. Let's say a "sarger" (he whose sole purpose is to "sarge," or pick up chicks) walks into a bar and runs a "yes ladder" routine - a series of basic questions designed to elicit positive answers - on an attractive gal before identifying her "trance words" and changing locales for a little "time distortion." Over a quiet supper, he puts her in a state of waking hypnosis through a little NLP, or neuro-linguistic programming. Then he takes her home, fucks her, snaps his fingers, and calls her a cab before she realizes the depth of what's actually transpired. Is that really consensual?

This is where Strauss might have developed The Game into a serious morality study. But you go to press with the book you have, not the book you need. And, lest we forget, Strauss is a guy who willingly chucked his New York Times perch to pen celebrity blow jobs for Rolling Stone and ghostwrite books for porn star Jenna Jameson and Dave Navarro.

In short, Strauss is an unabashed starfucker, and the remainder of his book merely chronicles his attempt to transform himself into a trash-pop literary stud along the lines of Bret Easton Ellis. He brags about his conquests like a second-grader who just found out what the word "boner" means. After he shares the news of cadging his first menage a trois via "dual induction massage," Strauss claims "PUAs all over the world started having threesomes" after initiating rubdowns of their purported harems of bi-curious ladies.

How does Strauss verify this? He doesn't, really. He just takes similar accounts posted on Web sites at face value. Whether you believe these "field reports" - or, for that matter, Strauss' own sexual exploits - depends on whether you believe Penthouse Forum is the real deal or written by hired hands. I don't doubt that Strauss and his boys "number closed" (i.e., collected phone numbers) on a fair amount of club-hopping floozies. But he only seems to have "f-closed" a couple chicks, including a 19-year-old single mother who works at a Toronto Hooters. (Afterward, he's forced to baby-sit her son.) I suspect he and his PUA brethren - like Steve Carell's buddies in The 40-Year-Old Virgin - are prone to exaggerate the number of their conquests.

But then, The Game is not about women; it's about men. (When Strauss and his PUA buddies rent a Hollywood Hills mansion and sit together in the Jacuzzi sipping watermelon-based cocktails, he declares, "There were no girls, and we didn't need any to validate us. Tonight, it was just the boys.") And like a lot of guys intrigued enough to read his book, my reaction was, Sorry, Neil, you can't sarge me.

-For the record, I think he's a guy that wrote this... (Mike?) and the book is riveting till the end... I finished it last night -Donovan


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posted by Donovan at 12:43 PM Dating Advice for Men


Anonymous Anonymous said...

The funniest part of the whole article written by "Mike" is that in order for any reader to understand his OPINION fully, you must be or have been a part of this "underground subculture" It seems like "Mike" is putting down this subculture and anyone who is a part of it. The real funny thing is, that in order for him to make the comments he makes or even to understand his OPINION “Mike” must have been part of it. References he makes lead me to believe he has been part of it for years now. Mike you might be right on a few men’s reasons for joining this subculture, but I really believe you failed in grasping what it is all about yourself, and you must of never really got it! The ones who never do realize what it is all about will in the end bash and ridicule because they don’t get it.

It’s not about hypnosis, tricks, tactics, etc. It’s all about the person you are and how you portray it to the world. I have read many books on sales, and in these books they teach you tricks and tactics that help you get the right message across to your clients. Once you’re a beginner you rely on these training wheels, but as you get better you realize that its not about tricks and tactics its about how you get your message across about your product and about you. The advanced salesman fully graduates once he no longer uses the tips in tricks because it is natural he doesn’t sells himself.

Mike its ok if you never got it, you focused on the wrong thing, it’s not about the training wheels it’s about you dude! I can’t speak for everyone in this subculture because some of them never get it like you and they really believe it’s about tricks, even some people that claim they are “gurus” sell it as tricks, but no real PUA believes in tricks. They believe in the science of social interaction.

10:42 PM, January 01, 2006  
Blogger Donovan said...

I 100% agree, nice comment anonymous. I put this one in so people know "Just how he doesn't get it"

12:21 AM, January 02, 2006  
Blogger yana said...

i was just listening to the radio and it was an interview with neil strauss!!! i just wanted to say that. hmmmm.

3:33 AM, February 07, 2006  

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Do you make this mistake when asking a woman out?


posted by Donovan at 4:46 PM

Earlier I mentioned that your questions have given me some insight into the way you THINK.

Let's talk about that.
flirting, making out, getting women's numbers, sexThe way you've phrased your question, "Could you tell me how to ask a woman out...?” tells me a few things...

1) It tells me that you believe that you're the one who has to do the asking

2) It tells me that you believe that you need to ask a woman "out on a date" when you DO "ask her"

3) It tells me that you believe that you're taking a big risk when you do (your words were "putting yourself out there").

4) It tells me that you ALREADY think that she has POWER OVER YOU... before you've even met her and "asked her out".

Whoa. Heavy, man.

What if I said that the answer was to never ask another woman out again?

What if I said that for the next year you need to only tell women what you're going to do, and let them know that if they'd like to join you they may, but if they choose not to, it's their loss?

What if I said that you're only risking something when you care what she thinks of you... and that once you get over caring what a woman thinks of you, your success will sky-rocket?

I realize that these might be "far-out" ideas, but if you round up 100 guys who are VERY successful with women, you'll find that MOST of them operate with these beliefs.

I can't do the "psychological brain surgery" that you seem to need in one email... but let me give you a new way to think about this...

Beautiful women aren't interested in being with men who are weak. They're not interested in men who have low self esteem. They're not interested in men who give away their power. They're not interested in men who don't GET what they want in life.

In other words, beautiful women aren't attracted to WUSSIES.

The type of thinking that you're showing me here is WUSSY thinking. It's weak.

It's saying, "She has the power”. I want her to be with me, so I need to "ask her out" in order to get her to spend time with me... if she rejects me, I will lose something".

You're basically suggesting that you lack something and she has it... and that you NEED what she has so badly that you'll do anything for it.

You've handed over your power before the game has even started.

And guess what kind of effect this is going to have on a woman you're trying to "ask out"?

Right, she's going to SMELL YOUR INNER WUSSY, whether it's in-person or over the phone.

She's going to hear it in your voice.

Women are PROS at sensing the Inner Wussy.

And women RESENT men that they can control.

So what's the answer?

You need to realize that YOU are the one who is the desirable prize. You are giving HER a great opportunity by making yourself available to her. You have nothing to lose if she doesn't spend time with you... in fact, she SAVED you time by eliminating herself from your consideration.

I'm not talking about becoming an arrogant,outwardly over-inflated JERK here.

I'm talking about how you THINK.

So next time you're on the phone with a woman that you've met recently, try this...

1) Call her and say, "Hey, WHAT’S UP?". Don't talk about work, family, or any other BORING topic.

2) Tease her and get back the fun mood that you hopefully created when you first met her.

3) Tell her that you're busy, but you might have some time on Saturday... and that if she's lucky you might let her hang out with you.

4) Hang up. That's right, tell her you have to go, and then GO.


Well, you need to learn how to not NEED her to like you. And you need to learn how to give a woman the gift of missing you. You need to learn how to LEAN BACK, and not care what happens.

These things will help you TREMENDOUSLY.

Finally, call her back on Saturday afternoon and say "Hey, I'm going to Starbucks, I think you should buy me a cup of tea and entertain me".

BIG DIFFERENCE between that approach and the way you've probably been doing things.

And I'm hoping that I've answered your "Where do I take a woman on the first date?" question as well...

Don't take her ANYWHERE. Let her take you out for a cup of tea. You can still pay, just to prove that you're a "gentleman" (by the way, if you say "I'm not paying for your tea because I like you, I'm paying for it because I am a gentleman", it's a nice touch).

And, if you're HELL BENT on going "out" somewhere with a woman (why men cling to the idea of going "out", instead of staying "in", I have no idea), then go to a mall and make fun of fashions, or go play a game of pool. DO SOMETHING THAT ISN'T BORING... whatever you do. And do something that doesn't say, "I'm trying to impress you".

But, let's face it. What you REALLY need is a TOTAL THINKING OVERHAUL.

It's not simple or easy to get rid of years of programming and beliefs. It's not going to happen in a few minutes.

If you need to get area of you're life IMPROVED DRAMATICALLY, get David's eBook which gives step-by-step instructions and lessons for the cost that's less than a dinner and movie. Download here.
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posted by Donovan at 4:46 PM Dating Advice for Men


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Mystery Method (1): The Outline

posted by Donovan at 12:18 PM

UPDATE! Do you want to get Mystery to teach you every step of the way? Check out his DVD Home Course.

Female-to-male attract phase (often called "attracting")
Male-to-female attract phase (or "qualifying")
Last-minute Resistance

The basic building block for everything we do is the M3 model. The model is a guide to what you should be doing at any given time with a woman, and when you should move on to the next phase. First, we'll lay out the basic framework with a couple of tips, and then over the next few issues, we'll go into details.
The three basic components are: ATTRACT, COMFORT, and SEDUCE. Each of these has three phases, which we have numbered 1 through 3. Here is the full list:

ATTRACT 1 (or A1): Opening
ATTRACT 2 (or A2): Female-to-male attract phase (often called "attracting")
ATTRACT 3 (or A3): Male-to-female attract phase (or "qualifying")
COMFORT 1 (or C1): Connection
COMFORT 2 (or C2): Trust
COMFORT 3 (or C3): Intimacy
SEDUCTION 1 (or S1): Arousal
SEDUCTION 2 (or S2): Last-minute Resistance
SEDUCTION 3 (or S3): Sex

We observe time and time again that successful courtships go through these nine phases in this order:

A1 (Opening): Obviously you have to initiate a conversation (or bait her into initiating one) before you can go anywhere. This phase usually last under a minute, but is excruciatingly important. We have a LOT to say about this, but for now, try a couple of things:
3 Second Rule: When you see someone you are interested in, go right in within 3 seconds. Otherwise you "stale out" in her eyes and make yourself nervous.

Convey minimal interest: Don't walk straight up to her. Come in at an angle between 45 and 90 degrees (don't approach from behind either). Initiate the conversation with dismissive body language (e.g., your head over your shoulder)

Smile on the approach
Have some "canned" openers ready. Make them short and accessible to a group of strangers and different from what they've heard before. "Did you see the fight outside?" is much better than some long story or "I like your hairstyle".

A1 ends once you've engaged a conversation. Once you've got that, MOVE ON to A2

A2 (Attract): Gaining attraction is easier than you think. Some ways to do this include negs, conveying alpha male characteristics (discuss later), and Demonstrating a Higher Value (DHV) than the thousands of other guys who have talked to her. Do NOT compliment her (that's for A3). We'll go into a lot of detail about this. A2 should take anywhere from 2-10 minutes, though with some women it can be up to 20. Once she is interested in you (touching you, asking you questions about yourself, etc.), then move onto A3.

A3 (Qualify): This phase is crucial. You need to give a woman a legitimate reason for why you are interested in her beyond her looks. Otherwise, what will happen is she will be interested in you (because of what you did in A2), and once you express interest in her, she'll often back off. She's interested in you because your A2 behavior suggested that you are the coolest guy ever. Girls know that they need to do some work to get guys like that (and they love doing the work . . . don't spoil the pick-up for her by making it too easy!). If you are "easy", she will know she has misjudged you and move on. Actually getting a woman to give you enough to have non-look based reasons to be interested in her can be hard. There will be a whole OAP component just on this. Anyway, for now, recognize that it needs to be done. Ask her what she has going for her. Give her compliments (not on her looks) if, but only if, she deserves them.

C1, C2, C3 (Comfort): Building comfort is the bulk of the pickup. You should be done with Attraction in half an hour. For most women (not party girls), the Comfort-phases will take 3 to 10 hours and may require separate meetings (sometimes thought of as "dates" -- although we don't date . . . we'll get into this later). These three phases are distinguished only by where they occur. C1 takes place in the same location where you attracted her (lounge, restaurant, party, bar, mall, etc.). C2 takes place in a comfort-building location (if you leave a lounge with her to go grab some food, for example, or arrange to meet up the next day on the beach). C3 takes place in your seduction location (e.g., your living room). In all of these phases, you are building comfort. Tone down the dismissive attitude. Don't try to go sexual yet. Make it fun. Make time pass.

S1, S2, S3 (Seduction): This is what you've been working towards. Make sure you don't start S1 (arousal) until you are ready to take it to S3 (sex). There is no point arousing a woman in a club if she's in a situation where you can't take her home. If you arouse a woman outside of the seduction location, you can make it hard for her to actually go to the seduction location with you. Most women don't want to think of themselves as sluts, so have evolved anti-slut defense (ASD). If you start touching a girl and turning her on sexually at a restaurant and then try to bring her home, she'll know that it's for sex and may feel like a slut for going with you and therefore decide not to. Believe me, when a woman goes home with you, she KNOWS that sex is a possibility, but do both of you a favor and let her feel seduced and swept away, not slutty. Don't start seducing her until you're somewhere where you can finish the job.

For complete explanation and expansion of the Mystery Method. Download the Magic Bullets ebook, written by the CEO of Mystery Method.


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posted by Donovan at 12:18 PM Dating Advice for Men


Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great post

One thing that isn't clearly mentioned in the A2 phase is the need to neg. I think it's an important part of generating attraction!

5:23 AM, May 08, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have bought the book and it is about as useful to me as a wet towel. Most of the method seems to say to attract the women with the procreation for the survival of the next generation, hence women tend to choose those with money or an edge over other men.

You do not have to tell me this, I already know that. I have had nightmares with women, the things they have done will chill you to the bone.

For one thing if you are a guy and have money, the multi-millionaire type which you have made for yourself and you are a decent guy, these will happen to you. The women you make love to will try to stuff the sperm from your condom into her vagina when you have left or are in the bathroom, that happened to me. Made me think to becoming gay, thankfully I was not attracted to men. Calling seven girls for a date and all of them turned up and refused to budge, my friend was a witness to this and he was amazed and asked me how I did it. I just said one thing money and confidence. Even with all this nasty thing happening to me I was finally caught by a girl which I think is incredibly smart. I broke off with her for a while after she put wedding magazines for me to see while I waited for her to get ready and in that seven days that I broke off with her I had seven new girlfriends.

Having women chasing after you is no fun. Most of the women ambush you by the second date by taking you to see their parents, yes some of them did that to me, or should I say most of them did that to me. Then there is the problem of not getting rejected ever a girl. I broke off more relationships than I care to say, I started chasing women which had boyfriends, it was easy to break off their relationships a Louis Vuitton bag that cost a couple of thousand dollars will always do the trick, if not jewellery, heck I can afford it.

The scary part would be to break off your reltionship with the girl, I am a coward, I won't call the girl ever and yet they call and call and beg and beg. Hence all I can say is good luck to you if you ever become rich, you will never be rejected by a girl but you will be hunted down by a girl sooner or later.

11:27 PM, May 07, 2007  
Blogger John "Kooz" Kuczmarski said...

women (and all people) are attracted to people with wealth, fame, charisma, talent, notoriety, sophistication, grace, charm, confidence. You DO have an edge (an intrinsic gift) in AT LEAST one of those areas. Build on that strength and exploit (utilize) the hell out of it. If you've got a conversational grace, that's a rare skill, and it will build you confidence, which generates Notoriety in a meeting place, and things escalate. Work on your strength and it will fill in the bucks. If you think some social moron with a Social Value IQ of 2 will thrive just because he's a millionaire, think again, he'll be stuck with the same money-leaching bimbos. Solid game revolves around building on your intrinsic strength and having fun WITH people NOT buying them.

9:41 AM, October 04, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Where can i find examples of NEGS,DHV,OPPENERS everything cause just explaining what it is doesn't help me at all because i'm just starting now and i can't make up my own yet

5:52 AM, June 03, 2008  
Anonymous Kris said...

Look, it does take a lot to walk up to a beautiful woman, especially one that can captivate the attention of an entire room and basically has her pick for the night.

5:28 AM, March 12, 2010  

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"All the right moves" Article (2005) on Neil Strauss


posted by Donovan at 3:32 PM

Sunday September 11, 2005
The Observer
"Neil Strauss was useless with women. Then he joined a secret society of nerds who, armed with top hats, gold leather boots and a fine line in 'waking hypnosis', mastered the art of picking up girls. Hundreds of conquests later, he reveals all to Emma Forrest"

Neil Strauss, pua, the author of the GameWriters do not usually have teeth that catch the sun as brilliantly as Neil Strauss's do. The teeth, along with the Lasik eye surgery, shaved head, defined goatee, tan and subtle extra inches on his boots all came to him on the orders of Mystery, the world's greatest seduction master, and Strauss's mentor when it came to writing his latest book, The Game, in which he penetrates the secret world of the modern pick-up artist, or PUA. The scar on his cheek is from Krav Maga, an Israeli self-defence class in which he failed to defend himself. It is, like surfing, a physical pursuit he took up in order to buff his puny body. He also did the Alexander Technique to improve his posture. When he helps other men now with their seduction art, he shows them where the top of their spine is (it's always higher than they think) so they can stand up straight and look like the alpha male in the room. They listen to him because, somewhere along the line, in writing about the secret society of pick-up artists, he became one of its most infamous members.

He welcomes me at the door wearing jeans, a black T-shirt and gold leather boots, a hangover from Mystery's insistence that his pupils always wear something that can be a conversation starter.

Strauss, now in his early thirties, has slept with hundreds of women, including a porn star in a bar who dragged him into the loo because she couldn't wait to have him. He pulled a woman's phone number while shopping for envelopes in the erotic environment of an office supply store, only to Google her and find she was the reigning Playboy Playmate of the Year. He got invited back to the hotel room of twin Goth burlesque dancers. He had on rotation a curvy Latina spitfire, a cool indie rock chick and Jessica 1 and Jessica 2, college students in a Miami hotel suite. And during a synthesis of his real job and new persona, he seduced Britney Spears during a Rolling Stone interview.

That he is very much an anti-hero is clear from the number of tricks and ruses he uses to bend women to his will. As pioneered by Mystery, he carried at all times a greatest hits packet of staged photos that he had 'just' had developed and which chronicled in one impressive roll his athleticism and daring (sky-diving), his tenderness (him with a puppy), and his close friendship with a celebrity. He used 'waking hypnosis' to lead girls up a 'Yes Ladder' ('Can I ask you a question' leads to 'Are you adventurous?' leads to 'Can you prove it?'). On Britney he used 'chick crack' - women's addiction to tarot, astrology, runes, word association games - things that most men are not interested in, but that he mastered in devotion to his cult. She didn't know this. All she knew was that they obviously shared a deep connection. He never used the cell phone number she gave him. By the time he met the love of his life, Lisa, he already had two huge manila envelopes of phone numbers, which he lovingly discarded in front of her the first night they spent together.

He had gone so deep under cover as to lose Neil Strauss the writer entirely, morphing instead in to 'Style'. When, a year into his life as Style, he published an article in the New York Times about the Pick-Up Artist culture, he lived in terror that he would be booted from the brotherhood. Instead, reality was so warped that the community was simply proud that one of its own had managed to get an article published in the New York Times.

Disciples of Eric Weber, author of the 1970 bestseller How To Pick Up Girls, the PUA community is a sub-cultural phenomenon: Casanovas with laptops, whose chronicles and code words flourish on the internet, with websites, conventions and lairs from Los Angeles to Edinburgh.

Under preposterous monikers like Extramask, Papa and Twotimer, natural-born nerds become seductive superheroes, mastering the skill not just of picking up chicks, not just making them fight to take you home, but of even making them feel OK about being fucked and chucked - the PUA's code of honour says: 'Always Leave Them Better Than You Found Them'. Clearly, this display of ethics is subjective - self-serving, even. But to PUAs, all interaction with women becomes mathematics - they make seduction pie charts and venn diagrams, as pioneered by Mystery, a one-time 21-year-old virgin from Canada turned Angeleno sex god. He wears top hats and eyeball jewellery he paints himself. And yet his hit rate is so high that it was with his seminar earnings - men pay $2,500 to learn at his feet - that he and a few select PUAs eventually launched a new millennium Rat Pack (Papa, Mystery, Style and 10 other PUAs rent a $30,000 a month mansion in the Hollywood Hills, conveniently located next to the Sunset Strip nightclubs).

'Men,' he says, 'are a hundred times worse than you can imagine. We are thinking the worst, shallowest thoughts, all the time. Every guy is - the interesting men, the rock stars. The good thing is that women have such high expectations of men that it inspires us to live up to them. That's what I learned about male-female relationships. I read Simone De Beauvoir's Second Sex before I wrote The Game. I wanted to be as honest and frank about male sexuality as she was about female sexuality. Unfortunately, male sexuality is a little bit uglier.'

Take the key PUA tactic of 'negging', in which, tapping into female insecurity, you offer a woman a line that is both compliment and insult: 'I like your skirt. I just saw another girl wearing the same one a moment ago.'

Bearing in mind that men are notoriously wary of self-help books about relationships, it could be said that The Game is a male self-help book in disguise, the camouflage being its smart humour and graphic sex scenes. Men are now, in many ways, sexually neutered, as they find themselves on equal footing, financially and career wise, with their prey. With no power advantage, men have to display something above and beyond. Watch any successful womaniser and they act out instinctively what the PUAs have devoted their lives to learning. Techniques such as negging and peacocking have always existed, but this is the first time the alphabet of male seduction has been painstakingly translated and written down.

The PUA alphabet turns out to be a dizzying cacophony of mind games, all designed to make a woman feel intimately connected to him, painstakingly mapping her psyche for manipulation. And in this day and age it's easily done. Mass culture over the past decade tells us that where once the underlying female instinct in falling in love was the search for security, now we are enslaved to the idea of a soul mate - there is one true love for us out there, one unmatched connection. Luckily for the PUAs that connection is, with the correct training, easily faked. Hence a combination of creative thinking - the pre-prepared photos, the runes, the word association - and obsession with scientific statistics. Men who, in their failure to seduce, were never considered masculine, creep their way in. Absolute power corrupts absolutely and if you have the key, how far do you go with it?

These are issues that aren't bothering the clientele of the Cattle Ranch, an exceptionally unpleasant Sunset Strip bar where Mystery is sending out his students to practise their technique. On a mechanical bull a wasted woman in a denim mini is now flashing her knickers; there is sawdust on the floor, though you can hardly see that for the scrum of tipsy girls in halterneck tops slamming jelly shots. The women here are poorly made-up and lairy, but they are myriad. Which is the point for the PUAs in training: go not for the best but for the most. When we arrive, trembling men come up to Strauss, or rather the legend known as Style. They ask him where he got his infamous flashing-word T-shirt (a conversation starter). A man who looks like Andy Bell from Erasure is wearing a bowler hat and carrying a Dr Seuss lunchbox.

(A lot of the grooming advice makes the followers appear effete - a trick. A favourite opening line is: 'If I wasn't gay you would so be mine!'). The man swings Dr Seuss in front of my eyes. He really wants me to notice it. Finally he asks another girl, 'Can you hold this for a sec?' A conversation starter.

Another man, ginger and buck toothed, introduces himself. I put out my hand to shake. He sloppily kisses my cheek. I recoil.

'Hey! That's too forward.'

'I'm from England!' he protests. Others have travelled from as far as Australia.

Strauss rescues me: 'I need you to be a pivot.'

'OK,' I say, not quite sure what I have agreed to. Turns out a perfectly cute young man has been talking to a girl, but now she is focusing on someone else. It is my job to stand near the young man and look fascinated by everything he says. He tells a joke and I laugh uproariously. She looks at me looking at him, and refocuses.

Finally, as final call is announced, Neil introduces me to Mystery, who has forgone the top hat for a ski cap.

'Hello Emma!' He fixes me with an unwavering stare and Clintonian double-palmed handshake. There is no one else in the room but he and I. And then, just as quickly, he drops my hand as if it were a bag of cold chips on the high street, and turns his back on me to speak to another girl. I am unanchored. I am bewildered. But mainly I want Mystery to pay attention to me.

'I wonder,' says Strauss, as we head back to the car, 'if that was accidental or on purpose. Whether he was negging you or not.'

There are groupies now for pick-up artists, which seems rather to be defeating the purpose. Indeed, it seems that Strauss got out in the nick of time. The house the PUAs rented in the Hollywood Hills disintegrated in a mire of internal fighting when Mystery fell in love with a Russian make-up artist who ultimately rejected him. He had a nervous breakdown. Now back in the game, Mystery's legend has travelled so far that two siliconed Latinas have made the journey from Miami to be picked up by him, both fighting for his attention. He takes the two of them home.

The only pick-up artist Strauss has ever met who was better than Mystery was Tom Cruise, who he interviewed for Rolling Stone. And though the actor's intensity was devoted not to seduction but to Scientology, Strauss felt they had a lot in common. It is rumoured that Cruise's character in Magnolia is based on PUA master Ross Jeffries.

Would women, I ask, be able to work the equivalent to The Game?

'But you already have it!' says Neil. 'It's the cover of every woman's magazine, of Cosmo and Glamour: "Six tips to get a man". "Six tips to keep him faithful." It's already part of your culture.'

He's not wrong. But there's a difference in the dedication required when shelling out for a magazine and spending, as Strauss did, two years learning how to pick up women. Was his writer's hat a convenient cover for an activity that is decidedly uncool, a bit sad even?

'I went in totally embarrassed. I could never have told anyone I was taking a course on picking up women when it's something I should have known how to do. I used to hang out with rock stars and go to cool parties. Instead, I was meeting Grimble and Twotimer at the Saddle Ranch ...'

We speed up Sunset past the Beverly Hills Hotel.

'But it gave me the confidence to approach Lisa.'

The negging didn't work on Lisa, the woman who, in the uplifting end of The Game, he falls in love with only to find her immune to his learned skills. Negging just pisses her off. In fact, nothing worked on Lisa, a guitarist who, like her boss and band-mate Courtney Love, tends to be the real alpha male in any room. Strauss couldn't get with her until he left the culture of the PUA behind.

And now, a year into the relationship and out of The Game, he has Lisa lounging poolside at his LA mansion. It is a Laurel Canyon beauty, with two floors (rare for LA), large Art Deco rooms and a garden strung with fairy lights and scented with jacaranda trees.

Lisa is in a blue grey T-shirt dress, form fitting, no bra. It hugs her curves - real curves. She has Debbie Harry bleach-blonde hair with dark roots and a broad New York accent. Lisa is what is known as an amazon; such an amazon that she puts Courtney Love in balance when they share the stage. Driving to a birthday party for the producer who has optioned The Game as a movie, Strauss proudly points out the Guitar Centre's huge billboard of Lisa leaning against Courtney, her fabulous guitar and ass on prominent display.

'Neil wasn't my type when I met him,' she laughs throatily. 'I always said my next boyfriend I got with would be really tall with lots of hair.'

Neil is 5ft6in and has a shaved head. Lisa doesn't give a damn that, in the two years before he met her, he slept with a lot of women.

'I don't care about someone's past if they're completely devoted to me. It means I'm more special than those hundred people they slept with. I feel bad for those hundred girls that didn't make the cut.'

Before Lisa, Strauss had had only two girlfriends. His job as the rock critic of the New York Times did nothing to enhance his confidence.

'I live in LA,' he sighs, 'I wanted a nose job.'

And yet, I note, when we take a booth table at the party, as soon as he got confidence he led a pack of men in search of what is referred to incessantly throughout the book as 'The Perfect 10'. Do the PUAs believe there's a science of a 10?

'Everyone's 10 is different,' he shrugs.

Isn't it always a stripper or porn star?

'Yeah,' says Lisa, suddenly irritated, 'it's always, like, some 19-year-old girl.'

'It is not!' says Neil.

'I have a question,' says Lisa. She wants to know if PUAs go for the 10s because growing up as nerds it was the girls who intimidated them the most. 'And once you realised you had no emotional connection with those skinny bims you grew up idealising, you decided to go for someone cooler?'

'But a hot girl isn't dumb or smart!' protests Neil. 'What about Hillary?' he asks, 'the girl who was a cool dancer?'

The stripper?

'The burlesque dancer.'

But if it's always a stripper or a porn star - or even Britney - you're talking about women with low self-esteem. Is it so amazing that you can pull them? Would the tactics work on ... Arundhati Roy?

'You have this perception,' says Neil, 'that it won't work on someone classy. But many of these women were smart. As much as guys are dogs, most people's 10s were always someone they could have a conversation with.' There is a real tenderness to the chapters in The Game on falling in love with Lisa that leaves you thinking of Strauss's time in the cult as a literal manifestation of the Courtney Love lyric, 'I fake it so real I am beyond fake'. Every technique in the book will work if all you want is to sleep with women. But they all go out the window when you fall in love.

When they got back from Spain, Neil put together a photo album for Lisa. It starts with their first kiss, which, as part of a tactic he tried on her, he took with a digital camera in a variety of poses ('Make a sad face! Now make a happy face! Now let's kiss!') It ends with Lisa asleep on his bed, in her underwear, one arm wrapped around her guitar, at ease. For real.

The Game, by Neil Strauss, is published by Canongate.
Check out additional information on these techniques on Mystery Method's new DVD's soon to be released in October, or signup for a live bootcamp.


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posted by Donovan at 3:32 PM Dating Advice for Men


Blogger Despedida said...

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11:08 PM, March 03, 2010  

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New York Times Article (2004) by Neil Strauss

posted by Donovan at 12:06 PM

Neil Strauss,
Sunday February 15, 2004

"Men who struggle to chat up women are turning to online seduction groups where they can learn the fine art of flirting."

I am far from attractive. My nose is large for my face and, while not hooked, has a bump in the ridge. Though I am not bald, to say that my hair is thinning would be an understatement. I have indentations on either side of my forehead, which I like and believe add character to my face, though I've never actually received a compliment on them. When I look down at my pale, skinny body, I wonder why any woman would want to sleep next to it, let alone embrace it. So for me, meeting women takes work. I'm not a guy they giggle over at a bar or want to take home because they're feeling drunk and crazy. I can't offer them a piece of my fame and bragging rights like a rock star. All I have is my mind and nobody can see that.

You may notice that I haven't mentioned my personality. That is because in the last year, my personality has completely changed. Or to put it more accurately, I have completely changed my personality. Researching a book proposed by an editor, I allowed myself to be taken under the wings of the selfproclaimed greatest pick-up artists in the world and entered an underground subculture of men dedicated - sometimes to an unhealthy and troubling extreme - to figuring out the mystery of the opposite sex. For lack of a better term, they refer to themselves simply as 'the community'.

For most, entry into this cult-like cross between self-help group and locker room begins on the internet. Type 'seduction' or 'how to meet women' into a search engine and you will find hundreds of sites trying to part you from your money. But the lucky few, able to wade through enticements to 'meet models now', may find one of the free usenet groups, internet mailing lists or message boards where hundreds of men labour day and night to turn the art of seduction into an exact science.

From New York to London to Croatia - places my reporting took me - many of these men meet offline in groups known, without irony, as lairs to discuss tactics and techniques before going out to bars and clubs to put their theories into practice.

It is a world with its own jargon (AFC, for example, denotes an Average Frustrated Chump, PUA a Pick-up Artist) and luminaries known by pseudonyms like Mystery and Juggler. Those who manage to earn the respect of their peers through online postings or real-world prowess can make money writing ebooks or running workshops. This has given birth to a seduction industry in America marketed almost entirely through online newsgroups and mailing lists. Some have turned it into a full-time career with six-figure incomes, others into a lucrative sideline allowing them to collect a few thousand dollars here and there.

One of the pioneers of the seduction community is Ross Jeffries, who, describing himself as unattractive and frustrated, wrote a small book called How to Get the Women You Desire Into Bed in the Eighties. His method was based on an adaptation of neurolinguistic programming, a school of hypnosis which believes that one can communicate with the subconscious through seemingly normal conversation. When a student of his created an internet newsgroup, the seduction community was born.

'I don't know if anybody can really understand the community until they get involved in it,' said Juggler, a comedian from Michigan, who teaches his own method, focused on approaching women directly and mastering the art of natural conversation. 'They view it as guys trying to be players and lying and doing anything for sex, and there are some people in the community who take that tack. But I find that the people who get really good at this aren't like that. That's because to get good, you have to believe you are the prize. And when you are the prize, you start doing more giving instead of more taking.'

Born Erik von Markovik, Mystery is known for spitting out long, detailed postings that read like algorithms of how to engineer social situations to meet and attract women. In detailing his social life online, he has singlehandedly invented much of the jargon and tactics that men around the world are using to meet women.

The 'neg', for example, is his invention. Neither a compliment nor an insult, a neg holds two purposes: momentarily to lower a woman's self-esteem and to suggest an intriguing disinterest. ('Nice nails. Are they real? No? Oh, they look nice anyway.') Mystery cautions online, however, that negging is only for exceptionally beautiful women who are used to a steady stream of compliments.

Speaking in a booming voice that he said was modelled on Tony Robbins, the motivational speaker, he explained his theory to me. 'Normally, the whole concept of meeting a woman is walking up to her when she's by herself and trying to seduce her. The game doesn't work that way.'

If a guy wants to meet a woman who is sitting at a table surrounded by men, he continued, he will most likely be rejected - or beaten up - if he walks straight up and asks for her phone number. He will be much more successful if he befriends the men first. After winning the goodwill of the group, he will be able to talk to the woman one on one, especially if he has already shown a lack of interest with a well-placed neg.

An extraordinary amount of effort seems to be needed to achieve something so shallow, raising a question: what, exactly, do men expect to get out of this? After talking to more than 100 would-be Casanovas, I rarely heard the same answer twice.

Some students - in their twenties, thirties, even forties - said they were virgins who had exhausted most other options in trying to meet women. 'My goal is to get comfortable with myself and show who I truly am,' said one 20-year-old. 'I feel like a Ferrari that is stuck in first gear when I know I have a sixth gear.' A millionaire I talked to said that he was looking for a wife. He soon succeeded - his first child is due this week. And one pick-up artist, who did not want to be identified, said his entire goal was to be in a committed three-way relationship consisting of himself and two beautiful women.

When I asked some women among my friends what they thought of socalled 'seduction coaching', most had no idea how much work men put into getting lucky. Danielle Rose, a student who had exchanged numbers with Mystery after meeting him in a bar, recalled: 'He came over a little like he was trying too hard. But he did seem like a nice guy, which is why I talked to him.' Informed of Mystery's sideline, she said: 'It doesn't change my impression of him, because some guys need the help.'

Juggler's ex-girlfriend, a 21-year-old student, admitted that his involvement with the community had caused problems in the relationship. 'The second or third time we saw each other, he said he had this job and taught guys how to pick up girls,' she said, speaking on condition of anonymity. 'So I got on the web and found the community. My initial reaction was disbelief. But the more I read, the more I felt that there was a huge objectification of women. And I started having pretty big problems with the entire community and his involvement in it.'

Several months after learning about the seduction industry and following many hours of coaching, I went to the VIP lounge of a bar in Miami. Two well-tanned women with matching platinum hair and white figure-revealing tanktops walked in, turning every head.

The women were talking to a man so, in keeping with Mystery's technique, I walked toward the group without even glancing at the women, focusing on the guy instead. I greeted him as if I knew him. Now that I was in range, I tried to break the ice. Nervously, I said the first thing that came to my head. 'You know what?' I told them. 'You both look like strange little snowflakes.'

It was nonsense, but I had their attention. I continued with what I knew all along would be my true opener, the neg: 'Is your hair real?'

The shorter girl looked shocked, but then recovered her composure. 'Yes,' she said. 'Feel it.' I tugged it gently. 'Hey, it moved. It's not real.'

'Pull harder.'

I complied. 'OK,' I said. 'I believe you. But how about your friend there?'

The taller woman's face reddened. She leaned over the bar and stared at me. 'That is really rude,' she said. 'What if I'm actually bald? That could really hurt someone's feelings. It's disrespectful.'

I had provoked a negative reaction, but now at least we had a relationship. I just had to turn her anger around to make it a good relationship.

'I'll tell you something,' I said. 'I live in Los Angeles. It's where the most beautiful women in the country come to try and make it. And do you know what I've learned? Beauty is common. It's something you're born with or you pay for. What counts is what you make of yourself.'

Her face relaxed. 'And you know what?' I added, as an afterthought. 'You have a great smile. I can tell that underneath all that, you're probably a good person.'

The shorter girl sidled up to me and said: 'We're sisters.' I looked very slowly at both of them, evaluating her comment, and took a chance. 'I don't buy it,' I said, smiling. 'I bet a lot of guys believe you, but I'm a very intuitive person. When I look at you both, I can tell that you're both very different. Too different.'

She broke into a guilty smile. 'We never tell anyone this,' she said, 'but you're right. We're just friends.'

Now the hard part was over.

'You're interesting,' the shorter woman gushed at one point. 'We have to hang out with you in LA.'

You may have noticed that I haven't used the women's names. This is because Mystery told me never to introduce myself. Wait for the woman to introduce herself, that way you know if she's interested. It's what Mystery calls an Indicator of Interest, or IOI, and when one gets three or four IOIs, the option to see the woman again is on the table.

The taller one asked what my zodiac sign was - another IOI. She suggested spending time together and gave me mobile phone numbers for both of them. But what pleased me even more was that she bought me a drink. I was excited not because I needed the free cocktail, but because she confessed that she and her friend had made a pact before the trip to trick guys into paying for all their drinks.

My days as an AFC, it seemed, were finally over.

© New York Times

Read "The Game" By Neil Strauss, uncovering the world of pickup artists. Check the sidebar for additional resources, like Mystery, and Double Your Dating.


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posted by Donovan at 12:06 PM Dating Advice for Men


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Pickup artists unite


posted by Donovan at 8:10 PM

By Mark Wolf, Rocky Mountain News September 24, 2005

You're a young single woman in a bar and a guy sidles over and asks, "Did you see those two girls fighting outside?"
Neil Strauss author of The Game: Penerating the Secret Society of Pickup ArtistsTruth be told, there probably weren't two girls, and if there were, they almost certainly weren't fighting. Even so, you probably reacted with interest, perhaps engaged the guy in conversation. This wasn't just a clever pickup line. You've been "opened." You may have responded with an IOI (indication of interest). Give him your phone number? You've been "number-closed." And introduced to an aspiring PUA (pickup artist) trying to escape the cocoon of the AFC (average frustrated chump).

This shorthand of seduction is the working jargon of a nationwide community of guys dedicated to the proposition that any woman can be engaged by most any man who has the right routine.

Neil Strauss, former pop-music critic for The New York Times, contributor to Rolling Stone and other magazines and the as-told-to author of volumes by Motley Crue and adult-film diva Jenna Jameson, dropped into the PUA community to write about it and stayed to become one of its masters.

"I didn't go into it skeptically. I went into it with embarrassment. I had nothing to lose. I thought I'd get some tips. I was the guy who'd always get the 'Can't we be friends?' line. I ended up on this roller-coaster life living in a pickup house with Courtney Love. It was beyond my wildest dreams. I got in too deep. It was seductive," said Strauss, who was in his late 20s when he spent two years in the pickup community.

Strauss' book, "The Game: Penetrating the Secret Society of Pick-up Artists" ( is a fascinating, funny and eXplicit peek into a community where the first rule of romance is manipulation.

"Everything is counterintuitive. Things I thought would never work do work," he says. "For example, you're at a bar and you get excited if a girl starts touching you. Instead, if you say, 'Hands off the merchandise,' and brush her hands away, she starts touching you even more. It shows your value and that you're not out for sex.

"The great irony of dating in these times is that, for a man, the best way to get sex is to act as if you don't want it."

Then there's "the neg": a mild negative comment about a beautiful woman's appearance. An example from the book: "Those are nice nails. Are they real?"

"It's horrible that it works," said Strauss. "It only works because we live in a society where women are judged by their looks, where men are constantly throwing compliments at women to try to sleep with them. (With 'the neg') you're showing higher value, actively showing disinterest. Her friends like you because she's always getting hit on. You make her work for it a little bit."

Master pickup artists shuffle their routines and bits into a virtual flow chart of pickup strategies. Ultimately, it's like teaching someone how to develop a couple of good minutes of standup comedy. Eventually, they have to be able to expand on the opportunity.

Strauss learned fast. At one point, an aspiring PUA compared Strauss' technique to John Elway's running of a two-minute drill.

"They're just excuses to show your personality. By the third date you have to be confident, have to be a good persona, interesting. For a lot of these guys, it's easier if they're running around doing a great opening set, but they're getting flakes," said Strauss, whose book includes a 10-page glossary of PUA terms.

"The goal for all these guys is to let these routines and techniques be training wheels they can drop off when they finally become naturals."

Women will probably find The Game by turns horrifying and edifying.

"They would say, 'This would never work on me.' It's an arrogant thing to say, but it was designed to work on you. The smarter and classier you are, the better it works, because you're paying attention. You're not some ADD club girl," Strauss said.

Some of the men he encounters are fairly pathetic; others are regular guys who admit they don't have a clue about how to approach women.

He estimates that several thousand active PUAs are posting in the community's online message boards and going out more than three times a week. Tens of thousands more are peripheral members, and more than a million names are on message lists worldwide.

About 10 guys are making six-figure incomes from seminars, books and tapes, Strauss said. One of the industry leaders, known as Mystery, gave a seminar in Denver last year, but Strauss said he doesn't know of an organized Denver PUA group.

Through it all, Strauss said, he felt more honest as a pickup artist than as an average frustrated chump.

"Love is supposed to be this natural thing that just happens and here's a guy learning this method; but in the past, you'd tell girls you want to have a relationship when you don't," he said.

"That's more hurtful than knowing how it works. I wasn't lying to anyone. I told them about the community at some point."

More info about Mystery, or Neil's book "The Game".


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posted by Donovan at 8:10 PM Dating Advice for Men


Anonymous Magnum said...

One more proof that Neil's book was a HUGE suicidal mystake for the seduction community...

3:58 PM, December 03, 2006  

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How To Flirt With A Woman To Get Her Attracted To You

posted by Donovan at 3:24 PM

By now, you should know how to engage a woman in conversation. Now, though that's an important skill to have, it's only HALF the battle.

The other half of the battle is moving from the MEET to getting her ATTRACTED to you.

Have you ever seen any of those cheesy dating shows on TV? You know the ones I'm talking about, where a camera crew follows a guy and a girl around on different dates and sees if they're going to "hook up" or not?

I must admit, these shows are guilty little pleasures of mine. But you can actually learn a LOT from watching them.
Flirting couple, approaching, pickup, pua
For instance, there's always a point in these shows where you can tell if the guy is going to score with his woman or not.

This usually happens over dinner where they're actually forced to interact with each other as opposed to going out and doing stupid "fun" activities the producers of the shows set them up on.

This is where the man and the woman actually get to know one another and find out if they're "compatible."

But the thing is, if you watch these shows closely... there's a pattern as to which guys get the girl and which guys don't!

And typically, this pattern has to do with one thing:


And when I say "the guy's ability to flirt," I'm talking about the guy's ability to introduce a SEXUAL energy into his interaction with the woman.

If a guy doesn't know how to flirt with a woman, he's going to fail to arouse any type of "spark" or "chemistry" between the two, and she's not going to be interested. This can either be from a
complete LACK of sexual energy, or too much sexual energy.

If a guy is too afraid to introduce the sexual element into his interactions with women, they're not going to look at him in a sexual manner. They may enjoy his company, they may even like him a good deal, but they won't be able to turn that into a "romantic" feeling.

On the flip side, if a guy goes too far and pours on the sexual element, this is going to turn a girl off, because there's no mystery or challenge. If you take the game out of the "game playing," you don't have a chance to win. Remember, though women enjoy sexuality, if you focus too strongly on it, they're going to feel as though you only want to use them for sex, and they won't want to be with you if that's the case (though there are exceptions to that rule, but for the most part, that's how it works).

So the trick is to introduce the sexual element into your interactions with the woman, but keep it subtle and slowly escalate it!

Back to these dating shows, if you watch the dinner scenes, you will always see that the guy who starts to talk about sex and flirt with the girl in a non-overt way, he will usually be making out
with her by the end of the date!

This is because flirting communicates to the woman you're with that you're interested in getting sexual with her, and you're giving her the opportunity to do the same with you.

So the real trick when it comes to flirting is communicating your sexuality in a non-threatening and fun way.

To flirt with a woman, you need to display two things:

1. Male sexuality
2. Confidence

Remember: Women are empathetic and emotional. They respond to strong emotion and feelings.

This means if you effectively send out your male sexuality and confidence when flirting, women WILL respond to it!

When it comes to communicating these traits, the non-verbal element is always more important than the verbal aspect. Too many guys think that just by chatting up a girl, they will be able to
successfully get her attracted.


Actions speak louder than words. Women will pick up on what you do way more than what you say. Your body language, voice tonality, and gestures will communicate all you need without you actually having to say anything.

For instance, let's say you see a beautiful woman and you walk up to her and say "Hello." Now, depending on how you walk up to her, and how you say hello, you can communicate anything from "You are the sexiest woman alive and I want to make mad, passionate love to
you," to "I'm just being polite and I'm not interested in you at all."

When you communicate your male sexuality, you must show that you're interested in a romantic interaction with a woman. Making jokes about sex, talking about sex, winking at her, teasing her... these are all ways you can communicate your sexuality.

When it comes to the confidence aspect, it comes down to you not being afraid to communicate your sexuality to her, and not making apologies for it.

Often times, a guy will make a forward comment to a woman, and then retreat with a "I'm just kidding," or "I didn't mean that," type comment.

This is the wrong thing to do.

If you look at a woman and playfully say something like "I know you WANT me," and she looks at you funny, stick to your guns. Don't retreat. Take it further. Tell her "You're trying to seduce me. You're trying to get in my pants!" Just keep it light and playful, and she'll come around.

And if she doesn't, it might be time to find a new woman to flirt with.

Flirting can be quite powerful because it not only communicates your interest in the woman you're with, but HER interest in YOU.

If you flirt with a woman and she flirts back by playing along -- guess what?


If she doesn't reciprocate, chances are she's not interested and you're wasting your time.

Use your skills at reading body language and flirting to gauge where you're woman is at and how far you need to take it.

Get your copy of David DeAngelo's eBook "Double Your Dating: What Every Man Should Know About Women" for more information about this topic. Also check out Thundercat's, "Art Of Approaching" a quality eBook, with new editions for both just released.
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posted by Donovan at 3:24 PM Dating Advice for Men


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Should You Compliment Women?


posted by Donovan at 12:05 PM

Here are the three that I'd like to address:

1) The idea that women LOVE to be complimented.

2) The idea that women spend all of the time and energy getting ready and fixing themselves up because they want compliments.

3) The difference between complimenting a "special" girl and complimenting just ANY girl.
Here are a few things to keep in mind as you read my commentary on this post and these different topics:

Get any woman1) We humans (and I'm talking about women in particular here) don't always REALIZE what we REALLY want.

2) We humans don't like to admit what's REALLY going on inside of us, because it can be irrational and illogical.

3) It's very important to realize that there is a CRITICAL difference between a girl you've just met or have dated a few times and a SPECIAL girl in your life.

So let's talk about the topics individually...


Do women love to be complimented?

I think so.

In fact, I think that many really ATTRACTIVE women FEED off of attention and compliments. The more attention and compliments they get, the better and more powerful they feel. It's an ego boost.

BUT... and it's a BUTTTTT bigger than J-Lo's, this doesn't mean that a woman will feel ATTRACTED to you if you give her compliments.

Attractive women get compliments in various forms all the time. In fact, they're so used to getting compliments, that's what they EXPECT.

As a matter of fact, if you start talking to an attractive woman and say, "Wow, you're really beautiful. I mean, you're like a goddess... are you a model or an actress?" etc., the most LIKELY response you're going to get is her giving you the cold shoulder.


Because SHE GOT WHAT SHE NEEDED FROM YOU and you showed her that you're JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER guy out there that will worship her for her physical beauty.

As a general rule, you ALWAYS want to avoid being mentally slotted into the "average" and "like all the other guys" category at ALL COST.

Now, I have started conversations by giving a woman a compliment, but I NEVER let it become part of the actual conversation. If anything, I begin teasing and making fun of her looks as soon as possible, if she's REALLY hot-looking. And I never give the compliment in a way that says, "I'm intimidated because you're obviously very powerful and desirable."

On to idea #2...


About 4 or 5 years ago when I was first learning about how to be successful with women, a good friend of mine said something that totally shocked me.

He said: "Women don't dress up for men, they dress up for each other."

I was stunned.

I couldn't understand the logic behind this for the life of me. It still makes me shake my head when I think about it.

As it so happens, I have lived in Southern California for a few years (San Diego and Los Angeles). This is a place where beautiful women from all over the world come to seek fame and fortune.

I have been able to see things and learn things here that would have taken much longer to learn if I had lived in other places, because I can see how attractive women interact with EACH OTHER more often.

If you put a group of attractive women together in a club or bar, and watch them carefully, you'll see something interesting begin to happen...

The women will start doing "catty" things, like looking each other up and down with disgusted looks, making negative comments to their friends about how other women look, and trying to intimidate other women with their eyes.

Most men would never notice this subtle communication that's going on between women, but if you look for it, you'll find it.

The fact is that women don't like to compete with each other on the football field, they compete to be the most attractive.

Men could really care less what a woman is wearing or how she's dressed for the most part. Sure, it's nice to see a woman dressed well, but it's just not that important.

But for women it's a whole different matter entirely.

Women, and especially attractive women, don't like the idea that another woman is getting more attention than her. And women can tell very quickly if another woman is more attractive... this leads to "bitch looks", negative comments, and other amazing displays.

To summarize, women don't spend a lot of time fixing themselves up to get compliments, they do it to compete with and impress other women. Ask a few attractive, well-dressed women about this and they'll tell you.

Finally, point #3...


My topic is women and dating.


It's not "women you're in a relationship with" or "special girls" or anything of the sort.

After you've gone out with a woman for a few months or so, and she proves to you beyond the shadow of a doubt that she's a great PERSON, then I think it's great to consider making her your "special girl."

And yes, the dynamics change at that point. You can be nicer... you can be more complimentary... you can do more thoughtful things... At this stage this kind of thing will have a different meaning (BUT DON'T EVER TURN INTO A WUSSY!).

But, as I just mentioned, if you start talking to an attractive woman and you immediately start with the "You are beautiful and I'm not worthy" routine, you shoot yourself in the foot.

There's a HUGE opportunity in these first-meeting situations, but most guys never even CONSIDER it because it's not what comes naturally.

The thing to do when you meet an attractive woman is to actually TEASE AND BUST on her a bit, rather than giving her compliments.

This effectively scrambles her whole program and causes her to lose her composure. It takes her off guard and shakes her out of her world... so you can actually have a conversation.

Remember the newsletter awhile back with the guy who walks up to women and says, "Your fly is open", then walks away?

The woman always comes and finds him to say, "You're a JERK!"... and then he laughs at her... and the woman winds up going out with him.

Verrrrrry interesting.

Do you think it would work the same way if he walked up to women and said, "You're amazingly beautiful" and then walked away?

I think not.

So, in summary, it's true... women do in fact like compliments. But if you want to make a woman feel that magical feeling of ATTRACTION for you, then you might think twice about giving them too early on.

Women like compliments that they have to WORK FOR a lot more than the ones that just come to them.

...and if you're reading this right now and thinking to yourself, "You know, I need to learn this stuff about how to meet and attract women so I can get rid of that insecure and fearful feeling I have", then YOU'RE RIGHT!

I think that every man should invest in himself and learn this skill.

Unfortunately, most guys never take the time and invest in themselves... and they wind up going their whole lives WISHING that they could attract the kinds of women that they want.

Well, I used to be one of the guys who didn't know what he was doing with women. Now I'm one of the guys who can go out anytime, in any situation and attract women.

What's the difference?


And if you'd like to learn, then I recommend you learn the things that I learned FIRST.

It's taken me a long time to figure all this stuff out, and it's also taken a lot of time, effort and energy on my part to put it all down on paper... so that any guy can learn from the things I've discovered.

I'd like to personally invite you to check out my materials. In a matter of hours you can learn things that it took me YEARS to figure out... all from the comfort and privacy of your own home.
The "Double Your Dating" eBook and 3 BONUS eBooks are now ONLY $19.95! Check them out NOW!

Thats over a 125% savings on the already massively discounted price! Thats less than a dinner and movie. No Risk! You can now try the hugely popular eBook with a 30-day free trial!

If you're not ready, just signup for my free emails, that will get you on your way to being hugely successful with women. More women await than you realize!
Your friend,
David Deangelo
Watch Live Pickup Videos

posted by Donovan at 12:05 PM Dating Advice for Men


Blogger yana said...

"Remember the newsletter awhile back with the guy who walks up to women and says, "Your fly is open", then walks away?

The woman always comes and finds him to say, "You're a JERK!"... and then he laughs at her... and the woman winds up going out with him."


8:15 AM, February 07, 2006  

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